crystal healing

Hi all

I know that I am opening my self up for a lot of flack on this but anyway...

I would like to know what every one's view on crystal healing is. Do crystals posses healing powers or not?
I personaly dont beleive in all metaphysical properties that crystals are supposed to posses.
How ever I do get a great scence of peace and calm working or even just looking at my collection. There is all so my ability to all ways find the good stuff on hunting trips and i could just put this down to the fact that i know how to look in the most likely places. How ever there are times that i have felt drawn to certainareas of the collecting site were I ahev found some of the best specimens of the day.
I have all so read that certain crystals have been known to emite high levels of infrared vibrations.

Hmmm, " crystal healing " I'm not sure about that one Donovan, but there is a nice feeling that comes with buying, owning, viewing or finding a high quality specimen.

Craig.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/05/2008 03:35AM by Craig Mercer.

Anything that gives you pleasure looking at it or listening to it, will provide a certain amount of relaxation. Nothing more to it than that. Crystals, art, music, tropical fish... fill in your favorite. Nothing more to it than that, IMO.

I hear fishing gives you the same feeling.

Frankly, I feel darn good when I sit amongst our minerals, does that count?

Gail Spann: Moderator of the Women and Minerals Forum for Mindat.

"Crystal healing" is what the glue does after I break the tourmaline in the trimmer.

If crystal healing had any validity, Mindat would be the healthiest community on earth. I woke up with a stuffy nose and a backache this morning. A nasty bug manages to circulate around the Tucson show every year despite it being the world's largest gathering of healing crystals in one location.

Yes, certain minerals are known to emit high levels of energy. It's advisable to limit your exposure to this energy as much as possible. The generally accepted standard for radiation safety in the U.S. is "no safe dose."

I once had a sliver of a healing quartz crystal stuck in my foot. It was not a spiritual experience.

Melody claims that Ajoite can rid a person of all negative qualities just by keeping a piece on ones person. I carried a small included crystal in my pocket for 18 months with no notable decrease in my negative qualities. Cynical as ever, perhaps even more so with regards to ridiculous claims such as these.

I think we all get a certain feeling of happiness when dealing with our minerals. Anything you love is going to have beneficial effects. It's been demonstrated that petting a cat lowers one's blood pressure. I'm not willing to take this as evidence that my cat has some "mojo voodoo jesus saves" kind of magic power over my circulatory system. That's no reason to love my cat, or minerals, any less.

I take it as an indication of inner bankruptcy that we feel the need for superstitious beliefs to live with a sense of awe, wonder, and hope.

Schorl is reputed to dispel negativity, and selenite is reputed to cause a clear mind and enhance organization. Now if I could only find my damn selenite amongst all this unlabeled tourmaline.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/05/2008 05:43AM by Steve Hardinger.

Crystal healing works by a process of sympathetic magic ....

If you believe it, it makes you feel very good very quickly. If you don't believe it, then you still feel better, just because someone is giving you sympathy and personal attention.

Of course, as far as healing energies are concerned - the reality is that a crystal talisman is no different than a StChristoper medallion or a Rabbit's Foot. For those attuned to the stones, though, yes they do call out to us, and yes, they do make us feel good ... especially a particularly fine or rare specimen.

When you invited me to see your etchings, I didn't expect to see so much degraded quartz. Really.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/05/2008 02:53PM by Alysson Rowan.

Crystal Healing is no better than voodoo or witchcraft. And unfortunately we're not allowed to burn them any more.

Steve Hardinger Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
> "Crystal healing" is what the glue does after I
> break the tourmaline in the trimmer.


Haha :-)

Crystal healing... If You have a bad headache, just put a nice sharp quartz crystal in your shoe, and go for a walk. After a while your headache feels like a minor thing...

The physical and mental well-being of the human animal are intimately related. Anything that gives one pleasure and puts one in a better mood will surely have a positive effect on ones physical state as well. To go beyond that and ascribe specific attributes to specific minerals is surely a case of someone with an over-active imagination and too much time on their hands. I personally wish these folks would stick to dreaming up alien abduction stories - they're much more entertaining.

A while back I came across a website dealing with the supposed metaphysical properties of minerals (and, of course, offering to sell them to you as well). One of the statements was that Rogerley fluorite is "the stone of genius." If that's the case, given all of the stuff I've handled why do I not have the full bank account and plush lifestyle to which I aspire? I did notice, however, that no money-back guarrantees were offered incase the stones did not perform as advertised.

I think the word for it is "psychosomatic".

Hey, how about a six leaf clover? A few years ago I found a bunch of 3+ leaf clovers growing on my mother's lawn (what was she feeding them with?!). Well, it's been a while and the mutant "power" doesn't seem to be working, I still haven't won the lottery!!!

Oh my god I cant believe this is here. OK my 1 million cents are going to be put in on this one. As some of you know i worked at a ship where rocks and minerals were sold. The owner was into the metaphysical, and healing aspects of crystals. He didn't know a thing about rocks other then they were pretty. So he hires a lady who used to own a shop here in town that went under to run his shop, now this lady was all about the "healing powers" of rocks and minerals. She was the fakest person I have ever dealt with, the nonsense she would spout about this mineral doing this to this part of your body always got a good chuckle out of me. As far as the healing powers of mineral or crystals this lady totally believed in it but she always had the sniffles or her back hurt or her eyes were going bad. She could never explain to me why her rocks could address those issues. After all she worked in a shop surrounded buy rocks and minerals. By her explanations to everybody that would listen that just being in the presence of rock and minerals would make you a healthier person. She was living proof that it is all bunk.


Byron

I suppose you could break it down to quantum mechanics where all atoms have a zero point energy meaning that there is always some form of free energy. Ofcoarse depending on the isotopes the energy for a specific element will be stronger or weaker. I'm just learning about this now but it's pretty neat stuff. Ofcoarse I'm just playing the devils advocate...but I do I gree with Gail...looking at my rocks sure makes me feel good.

I thought the title meant what it said, but was hoping that it referred to a crystal that had broken and later healed. Couldn't we have a "Healy Feely" board, where this claptrap can be discussed by those that feel the need, and ignored by those of us with a little more sense.

Bill G

"Couldn't we have a "Healy Feely" board, where this claptrap can be discussed by those that feel the need, and ignored by those of us with a little more sense."

But it's so much fun to discuss this (with tongue firmly in cheek). Besides, as a mineral associated phenomenon, it is a valid topic for discussion. Kind of.

When you invited me to see your etchings, I didn't expect to see so much degraded quartz. Really.

I believe in energy in a quantifiable scientific sense. I believe in Fermi energy, I believe in photovoltaic energy, I believe in energy in terms of radioactive decay and the electromagnetic spectrum, heat and various other forms or manifestions such as lattice zero state and so on. I am not sure what this "metaphysical" energy is (and no new age or metaphysical person can seem to define it for me), and I have yet to find a quartz crystal that has healed anything with it. I do have crystals which emit energy, and perhaps, if you were to take a small piece of one of them and implant it in a cancerous tumor, it *might* kill it, but I don't advise doing so.
So no, I don't believe in metaphysical energy.

I do find minerals interesting though and they do have positive health effects for those who enjoy them by relaxing the person, as would any other hobby the person enjoys.

Hi all,

I was personally led astray when I first became interested in mineral specimens. I walked into my local crystal shop, which I didn't know at the time, but later found out was a "Crystal Healing" shop. These people are nasty, deceitful, money hungry liars, I was basically brainwashed into thinking these rocks had mystical powers, and for the first 12 months of my obsession with minerals I was convinced they had these special powers. It wasn't until I came across Mindat and was straighten out, that's when I relised, I had been taken for a very expensive ride.

Anyway the one good thing that come out of it was the love I now have for minerals. My eyes are open to this fact now, but I still think it's all about educating future collectors before these people get their claws in, and threads like this will help. In conclusion I agree with Jolyon , to the stake.

Craig.



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/05/2008 10:27PM by Craig Mercer.

Alysson Rowan Wrote:
-------------------------------------------------------
>
> But it's so much fun to discuss this (with tongue
> firmly in cheek). Besides, as a mineral associated
> phenomenon, it is a valid topic for discussion.
> Kind of.


It still could be discussed, on it's own board.

Bill G



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/05/2008 10:23PM by Bill Gordon.

We have a "Fakes, Frauds and Marketing Ploys" board.

Hi David,

The problem there is, those that believe, don't think it's a Fake, Fraud or Marketing Ploy.

Bill G



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/06/2008 12:54PM by Bill Gordon.

But the rest of us think it is ! (A Fake, Fraud, or Marketing Ploy)

I have to admit that I enjoy the discussion. It certainly raises a lot of hackles.

I agree with David, and I don't see what Bill suggests as a problem. Since when do the uninformed get to define the parameters?

As a parallel, in the past, those who imbibed the products of other "snake-oil" salesmen didn't think it was fake either, and some payed a dear price for their faith in these products. I don't see much point in "beating around the bush" on this subject. If someone comes here for straight forward information and facts, it ought to be offered, not watered down to save the feelings of others (no one said you had to belittle those who've come to false conclusions or beliefs).

We ought to be direct, and give no wiggle room for debate on this issue. There really ISN'T any, so why suggest even in the smallest way, that there is? Yet another parallel, most addicts are pretty good at excusing their addiction, admitting it is a problem while in the same breath recusing themselves from ending it by convincing themselves there is SOME benefit to be realized as well (which there isn't). Like those who've been convinced to believe there are direct benefits to crystal healing, it does not serve them well to give them a pass for the sake of personal feeling, as it most likely will just provide them an "out", and allow them to continue on living this comforting lie, rather than confronting the uncomfortable fact that they really need to reassess their beliefs.

There are definitely downsides to these beliefs for the unaware. Not only will some of them avoid dealing with legitimate medical problems in favor of these quack solutions, I have also seen such absurd things as radioactive minerals being offered as carry-around talismens, and I've read in "healing" publications, advice and methods for making elixirs for consumption, from minerals including Malachite. One publication mentioned the benefits of Eastonite as an elixer. The majority of these specimens will most assuredly be coming from the quarries in Easton PA, which are rich in radioactive minerals. I have one Eastonite which is dotted with Thorainite xtls, the largest one measures to 1.5cm across. Who should be risking the consumption of such material, especially when considering the fact that there IS no chance of realizing any benefit from it?

If you think the idea of putting faith, and your very health, in the hands of these uninformed crystal healing practitioners and publication is an essentially harmless bit of fun, think again. If you really care about these people, just be firm and honest, and be more concerned with their health than their personal feelings on the subject.

MRH



Edited 1 time(s). Last edit at 09/06/2008 03:01PM by Mark Heintzelman.

"These people are nasty, deceitful, money hungry liars, I was basically brainwashed into thinking these rocks had mystical powers, and for the first 12 months of my obsession with minerals I was convinced they had these special powers."

They do .... they worm their way into your psyche, and force you to collect them ... and that's their whole power.

"As a parallel, in the past, those who imbibed the products of other "snake-oil" salesmen didn't think it was fake either, and some payed a dear price for their faith in these products."

You mean it isn't real? But I've been using it to keep the bicycle running smoothly for years!

When you invited me to see your etchings, I didn't expect to see so much degraded quartz. Really.

You really aren't going to change a lot of people's minds with posts here. There is also the well known placebo effect, as well as the effect on people when they have a sympathetic doctor just listen to them. Even scientists will often only grudgingly give up theories when facts prove them wrong (oftentimes the paradigm shift occurs only when the proponents of the old theory die off).

You may have a point David, but from my point of view, there are far too many cases in our histories where the lack of dissenting voices only lead to truly unfortunate results.

As such, I'll just keep "spitting into the wind" on this one, hoping in vane that it will have a positive affect on at least some folks, or as you may have alluded to, at least hold some hopes of discouraging new recruits from getting brought into the fold of these silly practices and beliefs. As far as placebo effect goes, no doubt we've not got all the answer to the mind/body relationship, nor even to what extent the limit of human potential and perception really is, but these hardly qualify as a point of validation for the sad and obvious perversions of reality put forth by the crystal healing community.

After living through the last eight years here in the states, it has become quite evident to me that, as far as the general society is concerned, the moniker "truth" is bestowed not upon the most correct, but upon that which is spoken most often, even when it is in obvious and direct conflict with what we traditionally consider knowable facts.

Short and sweet, I've simply no desire to be quite so complacent.



MRH

We mustn't forget that crystal healing is promoted by people who charge for this "service", in some cases to people who would have been better off going for genuine medical treatment. As such it is simply nothing more than a scam designed to extract money from the weak and desperate, I have absolutely no time for the sort of people who would do this, and it's a shame they're not being prosecuted for their fraud.

Jolyon

I think that if we are to be charitable in this matter, we have to say that there is no physical mechanism by which crystals can heal. I would be willing to bet that those who appeal to "quantum mechanics" or "electromagnetism" to justify their belief (or rationale) in such properties have never cracked a book on the subject that required them to solve a differential equation. Now maybe in the 10 or 26 dimensions of spacetime there could be some projection where the crystal miraculously overlaps yours and "heals you", but I'd really want to see some sort of string theory calculation to that effect.
So basically, known science would say this healing business is a bunch of fetid dingo's kidneys. I still know lots of otherwise intelligent people who believe in it.

for all those of us who don't believe, then crystal healing is slightly arcane

there are probably better anagrams, but this is my best shot!

over to you all

The metaphysical properties of crystals. I'm a small mineral dealer and I get asked that question a lot. Usually I just say I'm a non-believer an athesist, so speak. That usually satisfies the new age crowd.

On the other hand maybe the sub-atomic particle accelerator in Europe will create the elusive Higgs-bosun, the God particle,
and validate the theory of everything, and the universe will be reduced to interconnected vibrating strings of energy moving through eleven dimensions. That said anythings possible.

Jolyon, I hear you have a speaking engagement in Toronto. I dearly hope that I can attend.

Ray:

"Electromagnetic" is a favorite word among the metaphysical types. That and "frequency" "dimension" and "vibrations".

Let's not forget "astral plane" and "astral projection"

The latter of which I've only seen at planetariums.

In case one of them comes across this thread, there's a book called "Conceptual Physics" which does not require any understanding of algebra, which I have not read but have heard it's very good at conveying basic understanding.

I'd also like to dispell the image that scientists are all close minded and unwilling to investigate things if they sound silly. It's just not true. Scientists are curious people and usually more than willing to look into something when given a place to start.

Didn't do superman any good either..........

Selling crystals helps to heal my bank account.

Sorta odd how they think all crystals are benevolent. I mean, can't vrbaite have some evil powers or something?

It is often the case that the reasons people choose to believe in many things has little, if anything to do with rational thinking, but is rooted deeply in the emotion-driven nature of the human psyche. As folks who have been educated in the rational thought and sciences we often have a very difficult time accepting even the notion that there may be some validity, however fleeting, to such seemingly irrational and unscientific concepts such as "crystal healing." I have found, however, that having an open mind and a flexible attitude are necessary when encountering new and seemingly outlandish concepts and philosophies, least one potentially find oneself missing the boat leaving on the next paradigm shift. Any of you geologists out there who may have been an undergraduate in the early 1970s remember the old prof or two in the department who refused to believe in the new fantasy known as "plate tectonics"? I do. With this in mind, I've looked long and hard in an attempt to find what I think might be scientifically verifiable documentation of some form of "crystal healing. " Attached is a photo that I think gives indisputable evidence that this phenomonon is in fact real.

May the Feldspar be with you,
Jesse

I hope Crystal gets a good lawyer. There is probably a good payday in a malpractice suit.

Hello All,

If you have the slightest curiosity about the power of crystals, I suggest this book strongly...

Love Is in the Earth: A Kaleidoscope of Crystals (Love is in the Earth) (Love is in the Earth) by Melody and Julianne Guilbault
ISBN 0962819034 .

Very knowlegeable, without the " hocus pocus"......Joe

NH--

Well, there is the old lore about Opals having a negative effect on the wearer unless they're October born.

I've found that most minerals have a negative effect on my bank account.

I am fairy certain that Vrbaite slowly siphons your soul into an 11th dimensional holding tank where it is used as food for demons. Beware.

It might be fun to pen a leaflet on the negative qualities of healing stones. Hate is in the earth. Excess exposure to Ajoite causes mental deficiency. "Lemurian Seed" crystals lead to erectile dysfunction. Cornetite causes painful callouses on the feet. I have channelled this information from Joshua Norton, supreme purveyor of truth in the universe, while meditating on smectite.

I have been trying to get some professional mineralogy groups to issue a statement against the efficacy of crystal healing - so far without success.

For what it's worth, here is my draft statement. Feel free to kick it around. If there are any professional mineralogists who are willing to sign it, contact me at shallit@cs.uwaterloo.ca.

We, the undersigned, are professional mineralogists.

"Crystal healing" is not a recognized scientific or medical practice. There is no scientific support for the
claims of "crystal healers" that merely carrying, holding, or rubbing crystals on the body can cure any
disease. Studies by Christopher French and his colleagues at the University of London show that crystal
healers were unable to distinguish between a real quartz crystal and an imitation made of glass. Minerals
are chemical substances, and some (asbestos, radioactive minerals, arsenic minerals, witherite) may actually
constitute health hazards. Reliance on crystal healing for serious medical conditions may be hazardous
to your health and should not take the place of consultation with an accredited medical professional.

Joe,
Who you trying to kid? That's the VERY BOOK I complained about that suggests the Eastonite elixir!!!
I mean honestly, I read about as much of that one as I could stand. The false expertise this person tries to portray is nothing less than insufferable.

I don't mean to be rude, but truth be told, I'm stunned to hear you describe that pub in the manner in which you just did, I feel quite the opposite about it I can assure you.

MRH

Joe: here's my review of Melody's book:

[recursed.blogspot.com]

Bottom line: there is not a shred of evidence for Melody's claims. She simply made them up out of thin air.

Its an interesting social phenomenon and I gave the following opinion on another thread, which effectively killed it off - presumably totally offending absolutely everyone?

I must admit that crystals are certainly good for the soul, especially when you first dig them up, or even when you find some hidden treasures under the microscope. Not sure about making us better people but who knows what hopeless wretches some of us would be without them?

But there are other aspects to this argument that disturb me. I must admit that as a scientist I can find most religions and "beliefs" in general to appear to me mostly silly, sometimes laughable and occasionally horrifying. No matter whether the proponent is the Pope, a native aboriginal or a new age mystic. But my attitude is still that scientists don't know it all - aetheism is just as silly as religion, and there may be grains of truth in the silliest ideas. Rather than try to ridicule all such people it may be better to open a dialog, accept their need for beliefs, talk to them about what we know and understand, and hope some of it sinks in (I doubt if much goes the other way, but who knows what hidden knowledge may come out?). A bit like the old missionaries - accept the cultural differences but try to get your ideas to infiltrate slowly and hope your logic prevails.

The trouble is with science we mostly live too much in ivory towers and try to ignore the increasing push to fundamentalism by people who don't understand science, and who need some unwavering certainty in their lives that science cannot provide (witness the global warming debate). If they can gain some understanding of science and appreciation of nature by studying their crystals in a happy frame of mind, that seems a win-win situation.

At the some time we should certainly not be silent about the blatant frauds, scoundrels, health risks and lies that abound in these religions - but we won't convince the believers by dismissing their whole "religion" outright.

Ralph

The thing I've always wondered about with these pseudoscientific endeavors is how they guide their investigations. I mean, when they get a cold, do they just place every mineral close to their clogged nose and see which ones make them feel better? How do they know that the mineral they just tried won't negate the effect of the one they try next? And so on. With science, theory guides experiment, and experiment tells theory if it's on the right track. How would you begin to figure out something like this if you had no clue about how the phenomenon worked?

I do wonder how anyone ever know what works with many things - not just crystals and alternative medicines. Many people feel a cold or ache coming on and rush for any available pills and potions, and hey - in a week or so they are better - so it must have all worked! Some of us battle on without and, amazingly, in a week or so we feel better - our bodies manage to fight most bugs and ailments very well all by themselves! But the hypochondriacs and crystal people cannot believe that we can heal ourselves without some help - they need something they can put their "fix' down to. Any placebos do help of course (unless they are toxic minerals etc!).

Ralph

Hello Mark,

I am not trying to kid anyone....I am not the publisher, nor do i sell the book on my website..its just that there are so many people who happily subscribe to the books premises....so, live and let live!!......Joe

It should be noted that minerals are ingested every day by simply eating food, from both plants and animals, and sometimes augmented by taking multivitamins. Mineralogists hearken back to the earliest days of mankind, when people on this planet explored for and experimented with naturally occurring minerals and crystalline substances, creating some of the earliest medicines known to man. Most mineralogists will now quickly scoff at the idea of "healing" the body via minerals, which of course is a reaction caused by the split of religion from science occurring over the last century.

Perhaps visions of a "primitive" medicine man, or medieval witches and wizards - still lurk in the collective mind of the mineralogist, but what we c